Episode 39: What to Expect from Your Lactation Consultant

Welcome back to another episode of Breastfeeding Talk: Milk, Motherhood, Mindset. I’m your host, Jacqueline Kincer. And I really excited to do this episode for you today. Because it’s actually based on a listener question. And I love getting those. So if you have anything that you want to hear me talk about on this podcast or someone you think you’d love to have me interview, or anything at all, I would absolutely love to hear that feedback from you. So if you’d like you can definitely send an email to Hello at holistic lactation calm, or you can find me on Instagram at holistic lactation and send me a DM. So this question comes through from a listener named Jasmine, and she has been a longtime follower on Instagram, at least I know we’ve sort of messaged back and forth on there.

So it’s always awesome to you know, just hear from from people, you know, once again, and I really do honestly, very honestly, I’d love to hear your feedback, good or bad. So please, you know, feel free to share both with me and I always love the opportunity to learn, you know, I don’t think I’m perfect at all. So if there’s anything you think I could be doing better, by all means, let me know. And I love when people communicate directly to because, you know, when people just blindly sort of make a comments on social media or leave a review or something that, you know, we don’t really have communication or understanding, I love coming to understandings with people, I like going direct to the source. And I say that just from you know, personal experience and professional experience. Like right now, for instance, we’ve been going through the home buying and selling process.

And you know, cutting out the middleman sometimes is a really nice way to go just because that way everybody’s on the same page, you know, you can have an agent represent you and all the things and that’s always great. And there’s a time and a place, you know, but it is also sometimes just really nice to deal with people heart to heart and just go from there. So anyway, Jasmine’s question is, hey, Jacqueline, would you consider doing a podcast on what working with an IBCLC should look like?

I hear from so many moms that have a breastfeeding issue like low supply or nursing strike, they have tried, quote unquote, everything under the sun and hired an IBCLC or LLC to, but their issue just doesn’t improve. And now they’re back to hacking it alone or stopping altogether? What is reasonable to expect from an IBCLC? And what should they do if they can’t solve your issue? It would be really cool if a standard of care existed, even if it’s just one IBCLCs opinion, so people could evaluate the care they have received? I think that’s a great question. And I’m going to try to just, you know, answer it sort of piecemeal. And I think really, she’s asking a lot of questions that all have

one big answer to wrap it up in a bow. If I was going to answer this question with with one answer, it would be that if you’ve worked with someone and you have not gotten the results that you wanted, please, by all means go get a second opinion and try try someone else. And that’s not exclusive to lactation care. That would be true. If it was your dermatologist if it was a painter of your house, if it was a groomer for your dog. I mean, I don’t, I don’t think that it’s a great idea to settle with something that you’re unhappy with. Now, like I was just saying at the intro of the podcast, I think that you should address it with the provider directly.

I really do think that if you’re having an experience that is not up to your expectations with someone, it’s really always best if you can find a way to address that directly with that person first. Rather than leaving a bad review, rather than just going in seeking care elsewhere. You know, unless you’ve had just a very terrible experience and you don’t think that person would be receptive at all, but I actually think people are more receptive than we think and we just get in our heads too much. So that’s really up to you. And as a new parent, you probably don’t feel like If you have the time or the bandwidth to do that, but I would say if you can, at some point down the road, you know, I think that’s great. You know, this question I think comes from a place of someone who really cares about their friends who are wanting breastfeeding to work, but are not finding success.

And I have no idea who they’ve worked with and type of care they’ve gotten, I don’t know, if they’ve gone to a clinic if they’ve worked with an IBCLC, or someone with a different lactation credential, if they’ve only worked with someone in the hospital. I don’t know where they live. You know, I don’t know, if they’ve worked with someone virtually? You know, I don’t know. So there’s a lot of factors here. And I think maybe a lot of assumptions being made. And not that that’s bad. I think that her question is, is very valid.

And it’s a general question. And unfortunately, I just, I’ve worked with a fair number of clients who have gotten other lactation support, and then come to me because they didn’t get the results they wanted. And I have no doubt that there’s people that have worked with me and then gone on to work with someone different, I’ve just never heard about it. So that’s what I mean, I think it’s really important to go back to the provider directly that we’re having an issue with, to see if it’s something that can be worked out. And, you know,

I don’t like the that moms feel like they have to go it alone or stop breastfeeding because they didn’t get the support they were looking for. I do think there’s some responsibility on the parents to advocate for the care they’re getting. Sometimes I think there’s an assumption made that they only need one appointment with a lactation consultant. And that may not be true. In fact, I would say more often than not, I do more than one appointment with the families I work with. But that’s just me, every provider is going to work differently.

And to Jasmine’s point, she said, it would be really cool if a standard of care existed, you know, IBCLC is we do have a code of conduct, we have clinical competencies, we have a scope of practice. But you do need to keep in mind that our board is international. So there are many different circumstances all over the world in which IBCLC is practice. And there is usually a very big difference between hospital and private practice. So hospital means that you really don’t get to set your own rules and standard of care that is set for you by the hospital. Now, you may of course have, you know, staff meetings and things like that, where you provide some input, you know, as an IBCLC, or something of that nature.

But if you’re running your own private practice as a lactation consultant, well, then you pretty much get to call the shots, as long as you’re obviously adhering to all of the standards set forth by the International Board of lactation consultants, examiners, or IB, LC for short. So there is a standard of care. But just like anyone else in health care, there is no strict guideline that anyone really needs to follow.

And by that, I mean, you could go to one pediatrician who, you know, will prescribe antibiotics at the drop of the hat. And another who will say, I don’t think that’s a good idea, most of these things I treat are viral. And here’s what you should do instead. So standard of care, as much as we would love that, you know, I actually really love that we have the level of diversity that we do in the united states, and countries like Canada and the UK, that have, you know, a sort of state run health care system, if you will, I’m sure there’s a much better name for that. But I don’t live there. And I’m not quite familiar with the terminology.

But it’s paid for by taxpayer dollars, I do think they have more stringent standards of care, I could be wrong. And I’m happy to be wrong about that. But it does seem to be that there are like I know, in the UK, the NHS sets, certain protocols. And that’s just the way things are done, you get x number of ultrasounds pretty much no matter what you don’t get more, if you if you want more you pay for more yourself. And so it isn’t like that here in the United States where we have a lot more freedom and flexibility in our healthcare choices. And that can be a good thing. But sometimes it’s also a bad thing.

Because depending on where you live, you may not have access to a provider that practices a certain way. So there’s a lot of variables. But I will say that my heart really goes out to moms and I hear from many of them on social media, maybe you’re one who listens to this podcast, who say I’ve tried everything and it’s just not working. And there’s there’s two places to go from there. One is that maybe your issue is preceded by something else going on health history wise, that just cannot be changed at the moment. And, you know, this is kind of the limit of improvement that you’ve reached. That is true some of the time

or it may be that you’re, you know that. Yeah, I mean, I would say, you know, if you have IGT, if you have, you know, underlying hormonal issues, if your baby has something going on a heart defect or a cleft palate, and they’re not gonna have surgery for several months, I mean, there, there’s just only so much that we can do. And you may need to need to make peace with the situation. What I’m hearing, though the undertone, and Jasmine’s questions that these moms feel like, there’s still something more that can be done, they kind of know it in their heart of hearts and their guts.

But the person they worked with just wasn’t able to provide that for them, again, go back to that person, I would address that with them. But if you’ve done that, or feel like that’s just not going to pan out for you, I would suggest seeking a different lactation consultant, you know, and I think the cool thing about this pandemic, if there was any such thing is that many more have transitioned to doing virtual visits. And so you’re not limited by geography anymore. So meaning that let’s say if you live in a rural town somewhere, and you have to drive three hours to see the nearest lactation consultant, and that really didn’t work out for you. Well, now, it’s not like you need to drive five hours to see another one, you could really just, you know, schedule a virtual appointment with me or you know, anyone at all that you choose to work with, it doesn’t need to be me, but just giving you examples, so I don’t think and even if you are getting great care from your lactation consultants, maybe you just want a second opinion.

I really don’t think there’s anything wrong with that people do that in healthcare all the time. It’s encouraged actually, well, it should be encouraged, I will say it depends on the setting. But I absolutely think that you are entitled to that. And if that’s something you want to do, then do it. But I would say that trying to figure it out on your own, I want to give mom’s a lot of credit, and say that you so many of you are incredibly resourceful, and are able to find some solutions, you know, through through various channels. And that’s great. And if you’re able to find solutions to those channels, then you, you may not have needed a professional to help you anyway, on the flip side of that, I would say that you just don’t know what you don’t know.

And if you’re not trained in providing clinical lactation and breastfeeding support, then I would say it’s really unfair of you to expect yourself to be able to deliver that kind of care to yourself. So like, I mean, it sounds like an extreme example. But I’m not trained in neurosurgery. So I would never put a mirror behind my back and try to operate on my spine. I just wouldn’t I’m not trained in that it’s risky. Now, is breastfeeding the same level of risk as a spinal surgery? No, I get that. But there are things that lactation consultants do that are very, very clinical. And, you know, it really is health care and medical care to some degree.

So, you know, no, we don’t prescribe, you know, medications or do procedures or anything like that. But the way that we make a differential diagnosis, the way that we examine and assess both you and your baby, the way that we decide whether or not for you to use a medical device, such as a breast pump, things like that there, there is a lot and we are taking a holistic approach. You and your baby, both of your health history, birth history, breastfeeding history, you know, your social circumstances, all the things, right. And then we are coming up with a plan of care for you. And that plan of care might need to be it to be adjusted.

So here’s the other thing where I would say it’s great to give your lactation some benefit this out. Let’s say they give you a plan of care. And then you go to implement that plan of care and it’s not working, maybe things are even getting worse. It’s on your shoulders to go back to lactation consultants say the plan you gave me is not creating the results that I wanted. I’m still you know, struggling with XY and Z. I think it’s time to adjust the plan of care. And then you have another appointment with them. And there’s an reevaluation, there’s a reassessment and a new plan is created. So that’s the way it works. Now, some of you might choose to see your lactation consultant all the way through completion of care, meaning like your last appointment is, you know, sort of a checkup to make sure everything’s going great.

And it is and you’re basically discharged from care. Some of you may just decide, you know, the plan of care is working. And you know, I don’t need to follow up with my lactation consultants, they may or may not check in with you depending on their practice style, how busy they are, things like that. So, you know, if you’re sensing I guess my main point here to answer Jasmine’s question is that if you’re sensing that there’s something more that can be done, but you’ve exhausted all of all of the things that you’ve tried so far, maybe it’s time to try something new. You know, alternately, it may be time for you to make peace with this is just the best that it’s going to get.

The other big thing that I would say Is that any plan of care that a lactation consultant gives you is generally not some overnight fix. It’s very rare that anything in lactation land is just something that we just, you know, we’re like here do this. And then it’s all better. I mean, there are some things, right. But if you’re if you’re deep in it, if you’re really struggling with breastfeeding, you’ve got some complex issues, it’s usually not an overnight fix, like for, you know, just an example, if your baby has a tongue tight, getting a tongue tie procedure doesn’t fix breastfeeding automatically. That’s a procedure that enables the function, but function is something that changes and improves over time, and may require therapy to help. If it’s, you know,

you know, just the latch technique or something, and then you fix it, and you know, the soreness you’re experiencing goes away, great, maybe we did get you that quick fix, you know, so it just depends on the issue. But if you’re dealing with something lacks, and it’s not improving, that’s probably you know, something that you’re not going to expect an overnight fix on. So when of lactation consultant gives you their plan of care, the expectation there is that it’s rinse and repeat, right? You, you implement these things, you should see gradual improvement, you know, day over day, or every couple of days, things should be moving in the right direction. If they’re not, it’s your job to follow up with them and let them know.

But maybe it’s something that you need to be consistent about implementing for a week or two weeks before you really you’re going to see results. Hopefully, lactation consultant you’re working with sets that expectation for you, and gives you some anticipatory guidance in terms of like, you know, timeline of what to expect, and how to know that you need to contact them, again, to rework the plan, how to know if things are improving how to know if they’re not, you know, I would just say that’s ideally something that they should say, but I do know, you know, that my colleagues in the hospital often don’t get much time with the patients. So you know, if your baby’s latching at the breast, and maybe things aren’t going perfectly great, maybe it’s painful, or what have you, but they’re latching, they’re probably going to be like, Oh, that’s great, awesome, and go on to the next room with the baby that isn’t actually or the baby that’s lost too much weight, or, you know, the mom, that’s getting case of mastitis because, you know, they are more urgent of a case.

And that’s not because they don’t care, it’s not because they’re not a good lactation, and so on. They are both of those things, but just realize that it’s a different structure. Right. And they may not have that time, or they may, it may have slipped their mind, you know, they may also be doing double duty as an RN, and an IBCLC. So, you know, it’s, it’s easy to make assumptions. And, you know, I think it’s important to know, you know, what does lactation consultant do, what do I expect from various settings, and I’m really talking about US centric care. So if, you know, if you live in the Middle East or something, it’s going to be probably very different. You know, I’ve definitely spoken to colleagues over there.

And it’s, it looks very different. A colleague in India, it looks very different over there. So, you know, just know, I’m talking about, you know, us and not particularly rural areas, either. So, more urban-suburban areas, for the most part, because that’s where my experiences, and that’s generally the most of the colleagues I know, work in those similar circumstances. So, you know, they may not advise you in the hospital that if you know, here’s what to expect going forward, here’s what to expect, once your milk comes in. If you are experiencing XY and Z problem, you should probably either come back for an outpatient visit at the hospital lactation clinic if they have one, or directly to a private practice resource or something of that nature. So hopefully, they do that. But I know more often than not, that doesn’t happen.

Some hospitals have discharge packets. I know there’s several around here locally, that they’ll have, you know, my name my colleague’s names on a little list. So sometimes you need to look through your hospital paperwork, see if they’ve given you sort of any, you know, resources upon discharge for breastfeeding support. Not everybody does, at the hospital level. And I’ve got to tell you, it is a lot to get that kind of stuff done. It’s definitely a lot of phone calls and emails on my part to even get added to those lists. And I’m still on every hospital list. And I’ve been practicing for five years. So some just don’t give lists. They just don’t. And when it comes to hospital, you just have to deal with the hospital.

No. And unfortunately, the sad truth is, and this is not to bad mouth hospitals at all, I think they’re wonderful places we absolutely need them. And thank you for everyone who’s stuck it out and working in one during this pandemic, because that is just very, you know, that’s a whole other world of difficulty there, whether you’re working with COVID patients or not. But they do have policies, and they have them for a reason, because the hospitals have very big operation. And there are some politics at play sometimes, too. And I do know that a lot of my colleagues, usually it seems to happen from the pediatricians at the hospitals, but they’ve been sort of given a quote unquote gag order, not to mention tongue tie.

And so a lot of times when I work with clients, and we find out the baby has a tongue tie, and they’ll say, Well, why didn’t they tell me in the hospital, the lactation consultant came and checked, and they feel angry at that lactation consultant and all say No, I know just firsthand talking to black consultants work in the hospitals, they’re not even allowed to mention that phrase, they could get fired. And so that’s unfortunate, again, not too bad. Not that everyone not every hospital is that way, some hospitals will do a tongue tight release right then and there, you know, many lactation consultants are allowed to talk about it. So this is not to say, you know, hospital bad private practice, good. You know, it’s not at all I think we need all aspects of the care team. And you may not need an IBCLC, you know, you may need a lactation counselor educator, you just need some support, in that sense, not necessarily anything clinical, to address breastfeeding.

So there’s different levels of support, and I did a whole podcast on sort of the alphabet soup and lactation land a few episodes ago. So you’re welcome to check that out, if you want to dive in deep to, you know, the different levels of lactation providers there. But unfortunately, no, there’s not really a standard of care for lactation consultants in terms of, you know, exactly the things that will, you know, XYZ sort of a flowchart of care. Because everyone’s different. And we all work with different populations, we all work with, you know, different ethnic backgrounds, different socio economic status, different geographical locations, you know, IBCLCs prefer some tools that we’re not, you know, I may prefer one brand of nipple shields and a lactation consultant, you know, two miles away likes another brand, you know, and it’s just based on our own, you know, research that we’ve adhered to the conference’s we attend and our clinical experience. So we really do provide individualized care.

And I think that that is one of our strengths, I would say IBCLC is our profession with a really, really huge heart. And we also may be very busy, we are generally also working parents. So maybe we don’t always reach out to check in with you. But neither does your doctor most of the time. And I don’t know why I’m not saying that, like the standard of care that your average doctor gives is what we should make the standard of care everywhere, I do like giving a higher level of care than you get from just a, you know, a 15 minute urgent care visit. Right, I do appreciate the time and the quality that I can deliver to everyone that I work with. And I’m really lucky that I have my own practice. And I work in a setting that enables me to do that. Not everyone is able to do that. So if you if you’re having some expectations that aren’t getting met, a couple questions to ask yourself, are one, are my expectations reasonable? You know, am I am I maybe a bit, you know, sort of sleep deprived and hormonal and just experiencing challenges, and I’m blaming them on my lactation consultant, and maybe I could be the one who communicates better with, you know, her or, you know, expresses my needs better or something to that nature, you know, or is this really an issue of like, maybe I’m not getting great care, but then I need to maybe look elsewhere or decide not to pursue further care. So I don’t want to say that it’s all on you as the parent. But I would say that, in this world, I think it’s easy to be harsh on people that we don’t know, well, it’s easy to have big expectations and be disappointed. And in these crazy COVID times, I think that one, we need to be much nicer to one another much easier on ourselves even.

And to pandemic or not, we should be all of those things. But we need to really stop making assumptions. And so if you’re, if you’re assuming that things aren’t going well with breastfeeding, but maybe I would come in and look at your situation and go you know, things really aren’t that bad. And it just is going to take another week or so to notice a difference. You know, I think that I am a person who has a history of being hard on myself. In fact, with my herbal supplement that just launched, I sent a bottle to myself to see what that process was like to get a shipment from Amazon and get it and I opened the package and the bottle was did not look like what I thought it was going to look like. So long story short, when I went through the manufacturing process, I was told that all 90 capsules would fit into a 150 cc size bottle. Okay, great. So I have the labels printed. I have them sent to me for final approval so the size everything it’s all signed off on. I sign off on the size of the bottles, the cap, the seal all of it, right? Get the product manufactured put into capsules put into bottles, labeled see shipped. Okay, the bottle that arrived in my mail was a 200 cc bottle with the same label size, meaning that the bottle is bigger and the label is too small for the bottle. Now the bottle is chock full of capsules. So clearly, we needed to have a bigger bottle, but no one in the manufacturing process communicated this to me. And so I think it looks a bit silly. However, that doesn’t change the fact that the product actually works and works quite well. I’ve actually heard from two moms now on Instagram, because shipments have just started going out that even after taking their first dose, they’ve pumped way more milk. So that’s really exciting. One mom said she pumped 11 Extra ounces and woke up like ready, like she had to grab her baby and feed her because she was so full of milk. And then the other moms said that she was able to pump an entire extra Allen’s outwork after taking just one dose. So that’s huge. So I’m glad the product works. I don’t think a whole lot of people are gonna care. You probably are like, I wouldn’t have even noticed this. How do you not mention to Jacqueline, but the bottle label is a little it’s like it’s like fat guy and a little coat. If you’ve ever seen the movie, Tommy Boy, it’s fat guy in a little coat. Yeah, it’s like that scene. Um, so all the informations there, the ingredients, and the label was the whole pair. It’s all accurate. It just is the wrong size. And these things happen. And my point was with that tangent is that I do have a tendency to be hard on myself and I open that package and my heart sank. I’m just like, No, I’m a professional. And I work so hard to make this super high quality products that is like, made by lactation consultants that I know is going to work for people and the label is dumb, and it doesn’t look right. And you know what, you know what that did, that just put me in a really bad mood. But at the end of the day, it still helps people, it’s still an incredible product, whether or not the label fits the bottle properly. All of the relevant information is there. It’s all you know, you know, compliant with, you know, FDA and FTC and all the things. So checking with yourself is what I’m saying? Are you being too hard on yourself? Are you expecting breastfeeding perfection? You know, I, I had a client recently who I’ve worked with on and off, you know, for a few months now. And

I have I’ve helped her get to a place. This is where where I’ve put on more of my counseling hat in my role less of my clinician hat. I’ve helped her get to a place of your babies latches never going to be textbook perfect. And that is okay. Breastfeeding is still going beautifully. Your daughter is growing like a weed there. There’s really no issue here other than you don’t like her batch. And it’s not to say that there’s anything wrong with this mom for wanting to have a better latch. But I think being able to reassure her that the weight gain is excellent. The milk transfers Excellent. Developmentally, she’s doing great. In fact, she’s kind of ahead of the curve. I have no concerns about how breastfeeding is going.

Do I like the way her latch looks? No, I don’t. It’s shallow. But it’s working. And we’ve done everything we can to improve the latch. I mean, this is a mom who like goes to the chiropractor on the regular and she’s taken every bit of advice and implemented exactly how I’ve told her to, you know, she’s probably worked with another lactation consultant, if I were to guess. And this is it. This is the next level of improvement, but breastfeeding is going great. And more importantly, she’s meeting her breastfeeding goals. So sometimes it’s an issue of we as the parent are just being way too hard on ourselves, we’re expecting perfection, we’re saying, Well, how come my friend breastfeeds like this, and this baby does that and mine doesn’t? Well, you know, comparison is never really a healthy thing to do to be quite honest. So, again, I’m not trying to put any sort of blame on mom’s shoulders or anything like that, you know, I do think that you know, I’m not perfect. And you know, none of my colleagues are either if we’re really being honest here, and truly no one is no one on the entire planet Earth is perfect. And that’s just the way it is.

And I think we need to accept it. I think that there’s always room for improvement though, in terms of you know, being a professional. I am constantly seeking out you know, I go to conferences, I read new studies. You know, I stay in touch with colleagues, you know, across the world. I’m always trying to learn train to better train and grow. I like to get feedback from my clients, from podcast listeners and people on social media. I want to know what’s going on out there so that I can always improve what I’m delivering to people. So I think that’s really important. I think that most people that are lactation consultants think and feel the same way and I would say wishes all be easier on each other be easier on on one another busy ourselves, and I think things are just going to go so much better. You know, and so for the mom that feels like she’s tried every Everything under the sun, including hiring lactation consultant, you know, maybe you just need a different one, maybe there’s, you know, something to move into a place of acceptance that this is the max improvement you’re gonna get. I am one of those people that’s like an eternal optimist.

So if you come to me and you say, I’ve worked with three lactation consultants, and I’ve tried everything, and blah, blah, blah, and I’ll try to get you know, more of your story will tell me, tell me what you’ve tried, you know, if there’s some piece missing there that I can see, like, hey, there’s something she hasn’t tried, you know, then I’ll be like, hey, like, I think I can offer you something here, let’s work together. But if I don’t think there’s anything I can offer you and be like, Wow, it really does sound like you’ve tried everything. And I just don’t know if there’s any more I can offer you more than welcome to still work with me. But I don’t I don’t promise anything I don’t think I can deliver, you know, and I don’t really make promises at all, because that’s not fair to really anyone. But, you know, I am the eternal optimist. I think it was episode four of the podcast where I basically said, you know, I think you can always get improvement with breastfeeding. You know, even if it’s just another half pounds of milk, you’re able to pump or, you know, whatever it is, right? I think there’s most for the most part, there’s everything that can be improved.

But if you’ve done everything under the sun, that you know how to do, I think you should feel proud of yourself. As a parent, I think you should feel like, wow, look how amazing of an effort I’ve put into this, I really care about being the best mom to my baby, and I’m doing the best I can for my child, I think that you should really own that and be proud of that, and not make that a point of stress, and not see that as a failure. And just, I think one of the things about motherhood that sometimes breastfeeding ends up getting entangled in it, but it really doesn’t need to be it shouldn’t be that, you know, parenthood motherhood, it is about losing perfection, it is about a total reset of your expectations. It is about growing deeper into a new version of yourself. And one of those things is really just, you know, letting go, right? Maybe Maybe it’s letting go of your constantly clean house, you know, maybe it’s letting go of folding laundry, the moment it’s done, or whatever it is, right. I mean, we could give 1000 examples. Maybe it’s letting go of cooking gourmet dinners, because you just don’t have time now or you’re exhausted or whatever. So you’re sort of reinventing your routines. You’re reinventing your life, you’re reinventing the way you think about things, the way you approach things. And so maybe breastfeeding is just part of that. So I hope that that’s helpful. I don’t want to discount the question in any way, I hope that I’ve answered it, to her satisfaction and to your satisfaction as the listeners. But you know, again, go with your gut, really, you know, if you’re feeling like something’s off, and you have the resources to make it happen to work with someone else, or get a second opinion, or a third or fourth, or fifth or however many, maybe it’s not lactation. So you need to see maybe it’s a different type of provider, whatever it is, I really encourage you to just do whatever you think is best for you and your baby.

And if that’s giving it all up and switching to formula, I encourage you to do that. I do. And I think that’s sort of blasphemous in the world of lactation. But I think that you really have to make the choice that’s right for you. And only you know what that choices, and you know, the choice that your baby wants to. So you can always tune into that you can sense whether or not your baby’s happy or unhappy to some degree, right. And, you know, they’re not verbal, so they don’t really get a say, but I think that you really need to do what’s best for you and your family. And that’s an individual decision that has a lot of factors that you will consider when you’re making that choice. So that’s it for this episode. I hope that you enjoyed it, I hope that it made sense to you. And most of all, I hope that it encouraged you, I know there are quite a few of you IBCLCs out there that listen to the show, which is really fun, because I totally didn’t intend or expect for any of you to listen to it.

So thanks for listening. And I just want to say, huge shout out to all of you really, because I mean, I do this work. And I know that it’s not easy, and it’s also very emotionally heavy work at times, because there’s a lot that we encounter in our work and it’s easy to get emotionally invested with our clients. And we really want to do the best thing that we can for them. And we’re also trying to balance that with you know, being a great employee or running our own business. And so that’s that’s a lot so I applaud all of you out there who maybe are you know, studying to become IBCLCs are already are or other professionals out there in the field. Thank you for doing what you do.

And let’s all remember that everyone is usually doing the best that they can. And so when you encounter someone in you’re not the first provider they’ve seen, let’s let’s apply the advice I’ve given in the podcast to give people the benefit of the doubt to really try to uplift our colleagues And if there’s an opportunity for more communication and education there, I think it’s great to take that opportunity and you know, make some change. So, thanks for listening. I appreciate all of you and I will talk to you on the next episode.